DeSantis Mega Donor lobbied for Everytown for Gun Safety during Permitless-carry hearing

[Miami_JBT]

I appreciate your efforts on behalf of the Second Amendment, but when it comes to politics generally you can't stop beclowning yourself.

But, I am an asshole for saying the same things. Welcome to the club.

The Second Amendment is a massive issue, most people here believe that. But being absolutely monomanical about any one issue tends to distort reality for some people.

It is pretty unlikely that GOA is going to fully get what it wants out of Tallahasseee, true Constitutional Carry, which at a minimum includes Open Carry of handguns (IMHO true ConCarry would also include OC of long guns--the Second Amendment nowhere distiguishes between hand guns or long guns). So we are going to wind up with permitless carry of concealed handguns. Got it.

I agree this deal was fixed in advance, plainly. You don't have to be a genius to figure that out. So far so good.

But spiking OC has been a sport for the FL GOP long before DeSantis ever came on the politcal scene. Too bad our pre-July 2018 archives are all lost, because we (myself included) went on and on about this subject AGES ago. They'd use designated GOP fall guys (and girls) to do the trick. Remember Ellyn Bogdanoff (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellyn_Setnor_Bogdanoff)? She was one back in the day and she was driven from office in 2012, for Christ's sake. So the Johnny-come-latelys here can excuse me if am not in a state of shock over this year's developments. I really don't need to invent fairy tales about lobbyists controlling DeSantis to understand what is going on.

My advice to everyone is to take a nice, close shave with Occam's Razor.

I remember Bogdanoff... heck, I was at DCJ when her kid was brought in for burglary. She's the reason why we have 790.053 as the screwed up way it is.

Always push for what you want, never simply settle for what they originally offer. That is the key to confrontational politics.

Right now, they're offering HB 543 because of years of work MAKING IT AN ISSUE. I'm not a Johnny Come Lately player in this. Been at it now for over a decade.

[Miami_JBT]

Every Second Amendment right we lost, we lost through incrementalism. Every one we won, we won back through incrementalism.

If we can pass permitless carry without open carry, so be it. Still better than passing nothing.

It is GONG TO PASS. Thetr is no risk of it not passing. So, push to make it better. Incrementalism works in weak states. But FL is a Republican Supermajority State. Why are Republicans even worried about fallback when they control EVERYTHING

[tector]

Again, for the umpteenth time:

Great, go for it. We (or at least most of us) support you. FIne.

But you remain oblivious to the nature of the GOP in this state. Many GOP voters here are NE-transplant Fudds, especially the infusion we've received since 2020.

They support guns for hunting; they support guns for self-defense. They don't really buy into the 2A's actual purpose, however. And while they are generally cool with concealed carry, they don't want to take the kids' soccer team to Burger King and have some dude OCing an AR there. That's a bridge too far for them. They are never buying that.

So when you add up the Dems and Fudd Repubs, on OC your so-called FL supermajority is long gone--it doesn't even add up to a majority. THAT is the problem, not some frigging lobbying firm mesmerizing DeSantis or whatever else your overactive imagination has going on.

[wjbarricklow]

It is GONG TO PASS. Thetr is no risk of it not passing. So, push to make it better. Incrementalism works in weak states. But FL is a Republican Supermajority State. Why are Republicans even worried about fallback when they control EVERYTHING

If it's going to pass, make it open carry, apply it to 18-21 year olds, and apply it to everyone, not just residents.

[REDinFL]

I had a discussion with someone, friend of a friend, and one of the few open minded people from Massachusetts I've ever met. His argument against "permit less" carry was he wanted to keep felons, other criminals, people with violence in their backgrounds, etc. from the ability to carry. No discussion of open carry. My argument to him was that I agreed with his position that people convicted of certain violent crimes should not carry; then I told him that under Florida law, those very same people, and others such as "habitual drunkards" are not permitted even to possess. Can't possess, can't carry. He agreed with me. It is just that simple.

Open carry is another matter. I support open carry, though I'll only carry concealed, so that there's no discretion allowed a shavetail full of spit and vinegar from making a simple and brief exposure into a charge. I don't see any legitimate argument against open carry. If one can possess, what's the (legal) problem with it being seen? As far as nosey hysterical tourists, get used to the sight of freedom!

The rodent and other business issues are concerned, going to sell your birthright and soul for someone else's profit?

[tector]

The good ol' days.