Vehicle search by an employer.

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Japle
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Vehicle search by an employer.

Post by Japle » Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:34 pm

I’ve heard (sorry, I can’t remember where) that an employer is legally required to have a sworn LEO present if he wants to do a vehicle search in Florida.
I haven’t been able to find any reliable source for this and am wondering if any of you know for sure. It may just be an urban legend for all I know.
The second part is that the cops won’t help unless the employer is searching for something that’s illegal under Florida law, which wouldn't include a gun.

If anyone knows, please provide a reference.

Thanks.
John
Viera, FL

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CallMeLTC
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Post by CallMeLTC » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:12 pm

I've never heard of anything that would allow an employer to search a vehicle for any reason. I would assume that if their is illegal item/activities suspected, the legal thing to do would be for law enforcement to be contacted.

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Mighty Hd
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Post by Mighty Hd » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:37 pm

I'd tell them to get bent in a hurry.

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Post by RP86 » Tue Feb 13, 2007 11:33 pm

Perhaps if the cops or employer is for some reason looking for narcotics in the vehicles. They then could use K9's to see if they find anything from the exterior of the vehicle, if the K9 responds they then have probable cause. I don't see any reason why an employer would care about a firearm being in the vehicle. Unless they have a policy like Goodyear(from what I have heard) that strictly prohibits firearms on the property...

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Rentprop1
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Post by Rentprop1 » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:30 am

so if your company has a policy against firearms and if they are going to search, they are probably gonna find it, so why not just quit and leave :-k
Last edited by Rentprop1 on Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by glockpacker » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:31 am

I've heard of employment contracts where you sign away your right to privacy to get the job, and agree that the employer may search your vehicle at any time.

If you sign it, the contract rules.

If you want the job you sign it.
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jwillgym
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Post by jwillgym » Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:47 am

LEO doesn't have to be there (company property), because you have to give your employers permision to do the search. If you don't give them permision, they can't do the search. Furthermore, you will more than likely be terminated if you don't let them do it. It's all up to you...
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Post by Vault Dweller » Wed Feb 14, 2007 4:38 am

No LEO is required to be present.

Its the companies property, so its the companies rules.

I dont know about other places, but where Im at consent to vehicle searches and pat down are required for employment.


If you want to work here and we feel the need to search you or your car, either were going to conduct a search or youre going to be finding a new place to work (at the very least)

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mjrodney
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Post by mjrodney » Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:03 am

The major and international company that I work for has a policy of no firearms or ammunition on company property.

They reserve the right to search any employee's vehicle at any time.

Should that employee refuse to allow the search to take place, that employee will be terminated immediately.

Ten years of employment later, I have never heard of anyone's vehicle being searched.

Japle
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Post by Japle » Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:47 am

OK, let’s get a bit more specific.

My company has a policy forbidding weapons, not just guns, in employees’ cars while parked on company property. The policy mentions “immediate termination”. There’s nothing in company policy that mentions searching anyone’s car. As far as I can tell, they don’t have a written procedure to do a search.

Everyone has to read and sign the company policy. That doesn’t mean you’ll obey it, just that you understand it.

Company execs haven’t said a thing about searching cars, in fact one of the most senior guys told me he’s sure at least 2/3 of the cars in the lot have guns in them. We all know that some of the most senior, valuable execs have guns in their cars. This isn’t an immediate problem, but you never know.

I’ve been with this company nearly 10 years and I’m less than 2 years from retirement. It’s a pretty specialized job which pays well and I’m not interested in looking for another one.

I agree that if they were looking for drugs, they would have no problem getting police assistance. That’s not the question.
The question is, without written permission from an employee, does an employer have legal standing to force the employee to unlock his car for a search?
In there a Florida law that the employee can cite that will protect him from having his personal property searched against his will?

Please reference your answer.
John
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HotShot308
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Post by HotShot308 » Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:27 am

I don't have a legal answer, but my company has a similar policy.

My way around it is that I choose to get some extra exercise by parking off property and walking in to the building.

They have no legal standing to try to search if you are parked off property, and can't terminate you for refusing either, because your vehicle isn't on their property.

My .02
HotShot308

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Post by Cracker » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:40 am

Japle wrote:OK, let’s get a bit more specific.
I’ve been with this company nearly 10 years and I’m less than 2 years from retirement. It’s a pretty specialized job which pays well and I’m not interested in looking for another one.
Your answer is contained in the quoted statement. As in all things, you need to balance risk versus benefit. If you're like most of us, make that almost all of us, there has never been a time when you had to defend yourself with deadly force. There may have been times when you did, or you wanted to, but that's not the same as had to.

If your job and retirement benefits are more important to you than carrying a concealed weapon in your car, even though it's not right that you have to decide, you know how you should decide.

Lee

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Post by Cracker » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:42 am

HotShot308 wrote:I don't have a legal answer, but my company has a similar policy. My way around it is that I choose to get some extra exercise by parking off property and walking in to the building.
They have no legal standing to try to search if you are parked off property, and can't terminate you for refusing either, because your vehicle isn't on their property.
My .02
Sounds like an intelligent compromise.

Lee

Japle
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Post by Japle » Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:59 pm

Lee wrote:
If your job and retirement benefits are more important to you than carrying a concealed weapon in your car, even though it's not right that you have to decide, you know how you should decide.
I don't recall saying I didn't keep a gun in my car!

The state of Florida and 29 other states trust me to carry a concealed weapon. My employer may think he has the right to contradict all those legislators, but I don't have to agree.

And I don't.

But that's not the end of it. It would be good if I and all the others in my position could stop a search by citing a statute that requires an employer to have a LEO present for a search.
Apparently, no such law exists.
John
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mjmensale
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Post by mjmensale » Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:55 pm

Japle wrote:My company has a policy forbidding weapons, not just guns, in employees’ cars while parked on company property. The policy mentions “immediate termination”. There’s nothing in company policy that mentions searching anyone’s car. As far as I can tell, they don’t have a written procedure to do a search.
Your company's policy forbids weapons on company property but does your company have a written policy stating it has the discretion to conduct a search of an employee's possessions and vehicles for violations of that policy? If it doesn't, they would be hard pressed to perform a legal search.
Japle wrote:Company execs haven’t said a thing about searching cars, in fact one of the most senior guys told me he’s sure at least 2/3 of the cars in the lot have guns in them. We all know that some of the most senior, valuable execs have guns in their cars.


If, in fact, that is true, then the company has violated their own policy and has given defacto approval to the possession of weapons.

Moe
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Post by limestonecowboy » Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:24 pm

My company has a written policy on both weapons in personal cars on premises, and searches. However, should a forcible search ever occur, I would quit on the spot, and may show them just what they are looking for.

Chances are these policies are mandated by the businesses insurance carrier....
They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave.

Japle
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Post by Japle » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:02 pm

Moe,

As I stated earlier, there is no written policy on searching employees’ vehicles. I don’t expect this to be a problem, but I don’t like taking chances – one reason I tend to carry two guns and 40+ rounds of ammo.

And yes, there’s a good bit of hypocrisy here. When did that ever stop the execs of a multi-billion dollar company from doing what they want?
John
Viera, FL

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Diplomacy is the art of saying "Nice doggie" whilst you find a rock.
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