Changes to Florida Constitution

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tector
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Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by tector » Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:54 am

It should go without saying that this is a process we will need to watch carefully.

The sort of good news is that these proposed changes go on the ballot in November 2018 (just a year from now), when the turnout of Democrats and other undesirables should be somewhat less than a Presidential election year (based on historical trends).

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state ... MdZEl8bMN/
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Dave M » Wed Nov 01, 2017 8:34 pm

The 3 things that caught my eyes were restoring voters rights to felons after they have served their time and

Removing salaries from school board members, did I read that correctly?

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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by P5 guy » Thu Nov 02, 2017 6:10 am

OH NO! Raise the retirement age of judges to 75.
Lowering it would be my choice.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by randian » Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:36 am

Dave M wrote:
Wed Nov 01, 2017 8:34 pm
The 3 things that caught my eyes were restoring voters rights to felons after they have served their time and
Yep, it looks like they're trying to do to Florida what Terry McAuliffe did to Virginia, create a bunch of near-100% Democrat voters to sway state elections.

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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Cardboard_killer » Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:56 am

randian wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:36 am
Yep, it looks like they're trying to do to Florida what Terry McAuliffe did to Virginia, create a bunch of near-100% Democrat voters to sway state elections.
Convicts do not vote 100% democrat or anywhere near it; indeed, convicts even when they get their voting rights back usually don't vote period.

In any case, taking someone's rights away for the rest of their lives is a tool the government can use to repress the people. Governments shouldn't be able to strip rights forever. If someone deserves their rights taken away forever, then they should be put to death, or be in prison for the rest of their lives if the death penalty is not an option. So, let's start using the death penalty as it should be used.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by P5 guy » Mon Nov 06, 2017 7:06 am

Mr. Killer, do those re-enfranchised also get their gun rights back?
My not humble opinion is that anyone eligible to own firearms should also be eligible to vote or run for elected office.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by jjk308 » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:54 am

P5 guy wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 7:06 am
Mr. Killer, do those re-enfranchised also get their gun rights back?
My not humble opinion is that anyone eligible to own firearms should also be eligible to vote or run for elected office.
[smilie=cheers1.gif]
Please do not try and confuse someone with ideas that aren't reality based.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Cardboard_killer » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:42 am

P5 guy wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 7:06 am
Mr. Killer, do those re-enfranchised also get their gun rights back?
Mr. P, they can already via petition, and can get their voting rights back to by petition. I just think it should be automatic.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by TC6969 » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:44 am

Cardboard_killer wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:56 am
Convicts do not vote 100% democrat or anywhere near it; indeed, convicts even when they get their voting rights back usually don't vote period.
Where is the data that you based this statement on?

Link?
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Cardboard_killer » Mon Nov 06, 2017 12:49 pm

There are a lot of studies out there. Here's one from a simple google search:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/jail- ... le/2541412

But you shouldn't need a study to tell you that no one group of people votes for anything at 100% rate. 10% of black americans vote republican. Why would you think that 100% of ex-felons vote for democrats?
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Cardboard_killer » Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:57 am

TC6969 wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:44 am
Where is the data that you based this statement on?
Just repeating my question--why do you think convicts vote for democrats at a rate of 100%?
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by jjk308 » Tue Nov 07, 2017 7:46 am

Cardboard_killer wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:57 am
TC6969 wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:44 am
Where is the data that you based this statement on?
Just repeating my question--why do you think convicts vote for democrats at a rate of 100%?
The African American crime, conviction and incarceration rates are far higher than for White Americans and they vote overwhelmingly for Democrats.

Approximately 12–13% of the American population is African-American, but they make up 35% of jail inmates, and 37% of prison inmates of the 2.2 million male inmates as of 2014 (U.S. Department of Justice, 2014)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistic ... ican_males
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by g.willikers » Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:12 am

But what does those numbers actually say?
Are blacks that much more involved in the kind of crimes that would put them in jail, and for longer sentences?
Or is just easier to to successfully prosecute them?
Do blacks still get pulled over and searched more often?
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by TC6969 » Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:51 am

Cardboard_killer wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:57 am
TC6969 wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:44 am
Where is the data that you based this statement on?
Just repeating my question--why do you think convicts vote for democrats at a rate of 100%?
Ii don't recall saying I thought convicts voted for democrats at a rate of 100%.

I was just asking where you got your information.

I actually think you pulled it out of your ass, and then got lucky when I called you on it.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Gregh181 » Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:55 am

I will never be for felons voting. Not a chance. You lose that right once you do something that stupid
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Cardboard_killer » Tue Nov 07, 2017 12:18 pm

TC6969 wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:51 am
Ii don't recall saying I thought convicts voted for democrats at a rate of 100%.
Sorry, it another poster who I replied to.
TC6969 wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:51 am
I was just asking where you got your information.

I actually think you pulled it out of your ass, and then got lucky when I called you on it.
If you do think I pulled it out of my ass, that means you must have thought that 100% was correct, otherwise you'd know I was right. So, why did you think 100% was right?

And I didn't pull it out of my ass, I simply thought about it logically. Anyone that spent a few minutes thinking about it would know that it was impossible that 100% of felons voted any way or the other.

Your head is more than just a convenient aiming point for shooters; you can use it to think. And there's no such thing as luck.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by UnderdogII » Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:27 pm

Gregh181 wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:55 am
I will never be for felons voting. Not a chance. You lose that right once you do something that stupid
Do you realize just how many myriad state laws are felonies?

The charge? Molesting a blue crab trap.

That's a felony, although commission spokesman Leroy Alderson said the charge is likely to be reduced to a misdemeanor that would probably let Whitaker get off by paying a fine.

Yep pulling someone's else's crab trap. Florida statues are full of arcane laws that will cause you to
lose your voting rights and your gun rights.

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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by Rentprop1 » Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:22 am

If I was coming out of prison after 20 years the last thing I would care about would be voting.....you especially think I would have 20 years of Republican hating blood in my veins.... :ham'r
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by tector » Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:16 am

http://www.ncsl.org/research/elections- ... ights.aspx

As you can see, the majority of states, including several "conservative" ones, now have policies with automatic restoration of rights for some or all felons. The next time we have a liberal or even semi-liberal USSC, this is going to become the law of the land. People opposed to this are just playing for time.

I would also automatically restore gun rights for non-violent felons. I don't think any court would uphold the blanket suspension of First Amendment rights of released felons. Why should the Second Amendment be treated differently?
We are the ones who argue how it should have the same legal dignity as the First Amendment. We need to be consistent in advocating that view.
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Re: Changes to Florida Constitution

Post by jjk308 » Sat Dec 02, 2017 9:06 am

g.willikers wrote:
Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:12 am
But what does those numbers actually say?
Are blacks that much more involved in the kind of crimes that would put them in jail, and for longer sentences?
Or is just easier to to successfully prosecute them?
Do blacks still get pulled over and searched more often?
A reason I used wanting to ride my motorcycle as an excuse to meet up with my black friends, instead of riding with them back in my youth.
And they understood why, all too well.
They get arrested and searched and charged, prosecuted and convicted because their crime rates are much, much higher than for whites. The African American murder rate is 8.7 times that of whites according to the latest FBI surveys in the Uniform Crime Reports for 2016, indicating a serious problem in the culture of that community. And although crime overall has come down the Black/White murder rate ratio has gone up. It was only about 6 to 1 20 years ago.

The Latino murder rate is about 2.5 times that of whites and i suppose that is due to a combination of Machismo and the drug trade.

When you take out the effects of these 2 ethnic groups on the US murder rate it is close to the average for the European Union, and proof of the uselessness of gun control, the EU having much tougher gun laws than the USA and African Americans only owning 40% as many guns per capita as White Americans. Murder is a cultural artifact, not a result of hardware.
I swear by Jupiter Optimus Maximus .... in the army of the consul Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus and for 10 miles around it I will not steal anything worth more than a sestertius in any one day.

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