Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

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AirForceShooter
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Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by AirForceShooter » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:10 am

Passed and signed.
Now it's law.

State Attorney's brought this on themselves bringing charges in clear self defense cases.

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/337215 ... l-into-law

AFS
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FfNJGTFO
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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by FfNJGTFO » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:29 am

AirForceShooter wrote:Passed and signed.
Now it's law.

State Attorney's brought this on themselves bringing charges in clear self defense cases.

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/337215 ... l-into-law

AFS
But it's also reported that he signed SB-1052. So we'll see how that plays out in the courts... Watch yourself in your cars.

[smilie=popcorn.gif]

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by jjk308 » Sat Jun 10, 2017 8:33 am

Cars are included. Bill language is very clear.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2017/01052
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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by FfNJGTFO » Sat Jun 10, 2017 9:06 am

jjk308 wrote:Cars are included. Bill language is very clear.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2017/01052
They are included in re: the "presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm...." But SB-1052 would seem to remove the protection in re: a "duty to retreat..." when in a vehicle. Now, some might argue that FS 776.012 still covers us in re: "no duty to retreat" when anywhere else besides one's dwelling or residence, but, as they say, I wouldn't want to be the test case.

We'll see what happens... [smilie=popcorn.gif]

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gforester
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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by gforester » Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:34 pm

FfNJGTFO wrote:
jjk308 wrote:Cars are included. Bill language is very clear.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2017/01052
They are included in re: the "presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm...." But SB-1052 would seem to remove the protection in re: a "duty to retreat..." when in a vehicle. Now, some might argue that FS 776.012 still covers us in re: "no duty to retreat" when anywhere else besides one's dwelling or residence, but, as they say, I wouldn't want to be the test case.

We'll see what happens... [smilie=popcorn.gif]
I'm pretty sure that Florida case law supports the premise that your vehicle is considered and extension of your domicile. In other words the "Castle Doctrine" applies when you are in your car.

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by FfNJGTFO » Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:31 pm

gforester wrote:
FfNJGTFO wrote:
jjk308 wrote:Cars are included. Bill language is very clear.

https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2017/01052
They are included in re: the "presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm...." But SB-1052 would seem to remove the protection in re: a "duty to retreat..." when in a vehicle. Now, some might argue that FS 776.012 still covers us in re: "no duty to retreat" when anywhere else besides one's dwelling or residence, but, as they say, I wouldn't want to be the test case.

We'll see what happens... [smilie=popcorn.gif]
I'm pretty sure that Florida case law supports the premise that your vehicle is considered and extension of your domicile. In other words the "Castle Doctrine" applies when you are in your car.
Let us all hope the case law doesn't change given this change in the statute.

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by czharry » Sat Jun 10, 2017 6:40 pm

This is a bit more detail that includes how the self defense law got subverted.
I am not worried in the least on SYG/SD whether in a vehicle, my home, or anywhere the need for self defense arises.
I don't feel the need to "be careful" while in my car. This is win for the legally armed citizen.

And though I appreciate the tough stance against crime, Miami-Dade's Katherine Fernandez-Rundell is still a democrat and sides with liberals against SYG/SD. Now, hopefully, she will HAVE to obey the law.


Florida Action Report! Gov. Rick Scott has SIGNED SB-128 & SB-1052
DATE: June 10, 2017
TO: USF & NRA Members and Friends
FROM: Marion P. Hammer
USF Executive Director
NRA Past President


Early yesterday evening, Friday, June 9th, Governor Rick Scott SIGNED INTO LAW the two critically important self-defense bills we have been urging him to sign.

One, SB-128 Burden of Proof by Sen. Rob Bradley and Rep. Bobby Payne restores the presumption of innocence in self-defense cases by putting the burden of proof BACK ON THE STATE where it belongs. SB-128 took effect IMMEDIATELY.

When prosecutors and judges use procedures to circumvent the rights of law-abiding people and the will of the Legislature, it cannot be tolerated.

Procedures do not have the weight of law and now the Legislature and the Governor have erased these abusive procedures in self-defense cases and have legislatively made sure these self-defense rights are reinstated. Pending cases should have the retroactive benefit of the Legislature and the Governor erasing these malicious procedures.

The second, SB-1052 Justifiable Use of Force by Sen. David Simmons and Rep. Cord Byrd corrects a 2014 drafting error (by a member of the House Criminal Justice Committee Staff) resulting in a requirement that citizens be under attack in their own homes before exercising self-defense – and in some circumstances imposing a duty to retreat from your home before exercising self-defense.

BACKGROUND on Burden of Proof:

In 2005, people who exercised self-defense were being prosecuted like criminals, and courts – with no legislative authority – were imposing a "duty to retreat" in self-defense cases.

Courts were instructing juries to find victims guilty if the victim had not tried to run away before fighting back against a criminal attack.

So the Legislature took action to restore the constitutional right of self-defense and created a specific, statutory right of immunity for people who defend themselves from attack.

That law prohibits arresting, detaining in custody, charging and prosecuting unless and until an investigation reveals there is probable cause to believe the act was not lawful self-defense.

But some prosecutors and judges didn't like it so they found a way to usurp the law and bypass the intent of the Legislature.

With no legislative authority, they created a special "Stand Your Ground" hearing and reversed the burden of proof from the state to the victim. Through case law, they changed a legislative law they didn't like.

They effectively created the presumption of guilt for the exercise of self-defense.

After conspiring to create an extra hearing in self-defense cases, prosecutors are now arguing that it would be ‘too much work for them' if the State has the burden of proof in this additional hearing and they actually have to prove their cases.

And in July, 2015, the majority of the Florida Supreme Court found that victims SHOULD have the burden of proof and prove they are "entitled to immunity provided by the Legislature." It is an outrageous opinion.

Supreme Court Justice Charles Canady and Justice Ricky Poltson strongly objected and in dissenting opinion, Canady wrote that the majority opinion, "Substantially curtails the benefit of the immunity from trial conferred by the Legislature under the Stand Your Ground law."

Further, he wrote that the majority "cannot justify curtailing the immunity ..."And that this problem is a matter for the Legislature to resolve.

In other words it's up to the Legislature to put it back. This bill fixes it. It places the burden of proof back on the state where it belongs. And it restores the right of the presumption of innocence and the right of self-defense.
.
There's a storm coming.

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by jjk308 » Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:26 am

Cars are covered in 1052

1052 SECTION 1 (2)

A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear
29 of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or
30 herself or another when using or threatening to use defensive
31 force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily
32 harm to another if:
33 (a) The person against whom the defensive force was used or
34 threatened was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully
35 entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling,
36 residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or
37 was attempting to remove another against that person’s will from
38 the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle;

How do you intend to retreat inside a car? Aside from hitting the accelerator and getting the whole thing away you can't. And if you can get away you certainly should. I suspect this is why the retreat clause did not include cars.

And it is covered by FS 776.012:

(2) .... A person who uses or threatens to use deadly force in accordance with this subsection does not have a duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground if the person using or threatening to use the deadly force is not engaged in a criminal activity and is in a place where he or she has a right to be.

That covers everything!
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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by FfNJGTFO » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:03 am

jjk308 wrote:
How do you intend to retreat inside a car? Aside from hitting the accelerator and getting the whole thing away you can't. And if you can get away you certainly should.
I think that's what the "Antis" want to encourage... This, after the Michael Dunn incident.
jjk308 wrote:And it is covered by FS 776.012:

(2) .... A person who uses or threatens to use deadly force in accordance with this subsection does not have a duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground if the person using or threatening to use the deadly force is not engaged in a criminal activity and is in a place where he or she has a right to be.

That covers everything!

Like I said, let's hope he judges think that way as well. We'll see.. [smilie=popcorn.gif]

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by jjk308 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:41 pm

FfNJGTFO wrote:
jjk308 wrote:
How do you intend to retreat inside a car? Aside from hitting the accelerator and getting the whole thing away you can't. And if you can get away you certainly should.
I think that's what the "Antis" want to encourage... This, after the Michael Dunn incident.
It sure as hell doesn't cover shooting someone because they are playing loud music. Or threats from an apparently imaginary shotgun. If you think ANY stand your ground rewrite could have kept Dunn's butt out of prison please tell us how.
I swear by Jupiter Optimus Maximus .... in the army of the consul Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus and for 10 miles around it I will not steal anything worth more than a sestertius in any one day.

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Re: Scott signs improved Stand Your Ground

Post by FfNJGTFO » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:59 pm

jjk308 wrote:
FfNJGTFO wrote:
jjk308 wrote:
How do you intend to retreat inside a car? Aside from hitting the accelerator and getting the whole thing away you can't. And if you can get away you certainly should.
I think that's what the "Antis" want to encourage... This, after the Michael Dunn incident.
It sure as hell doesn't cover shooting someone because they are playing loud music. Or threats from an apparently imaginary shotgun. If you think ANY stand your ground rewrite could have kept Dunn's butt out of prison please tell us how.
Oh, I don't think it... but I believe *they* (antis) think it, or they're just trying to use it as an excuse to curtail SYG thinking the sheeples will think it. [smilie=042.gif]

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