Winning a real gunfight

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Winning a real gunfight

Post by Standby » Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:21 pm

What’s the chances of a Concealed Weapon Permit holder actually winning a real gunfight? This is a question often asked at our Advanced Defensive Pistol Classes.

What are your thoughts on this, what do YOU think will make the difference in winning YOUR lethal force confrontation. What you train and practice the most to prepare you for this?
Last edited by Standby on Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Winning a real gunfight

Post by FSUnoles » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:14 pm

Element of surprise and shot placement

Tom Givens
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Re: Winning a real gunfight

Post by Tom Givens » Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:28 pm

Lessons From 5,000 Gunfights!

John Correia does business as ASP, or Active Self Protection. The letters stand for Attitude, Skills and Plan, essential elements of successful self defense. John has a You Tube channel at ... ImeNWh84mw . Each and every day he posts and narrates a surveillance video of a criminal attack against a citizen, and most of these involve firearms. In the course of curating these videos for several years, John has watched over 5,000 self defense episodes on these surveillance videos. I know John. He was in one of our Firearms Instructor Development Courses last year and had the second best aggregate score in a large class with a lot of switched on students. I suggest you pay attention to what he has to say here.

John says:
I've watched about 5,000 gunfights at this point, and the patterns that emerge are pretty clear. Some thoughts you might want to consider that I don't think that the training community really wants to hear:

1. Most gunfights aren't entangled gunfights. Empty-handed skills are important, but very rare once the gun comes out. They're necessary for LE more than CCW, by a long shot. For CCW, empty-handed skills are critical for the 80% of assaults that don't rise to the level of deadly force response. So go to your martial arts training.

2. Reloads are almost vanishingly insignificant factors in gunfights. I have seen precisely 2 reloads in a real gunfight that weren't on-duty LEO. And neither of those affected the outcome of the fight. I have seen about 7 or 8 where a higher capacity firearm or the presence of a reload might have affected the outcome. So 0.2% of what I have witnessed. Don't spend much valuable class time teaching emergency and retention least until your highest level classes where all the fundamentals are flawless. I like Tom Givens' focus on the PROACTIVE reload once the fight is over. That has value in my opinion.

3. He who puts the first shot into meaty bits on the other guy, wins. Not 100%, but darn near, at least partially because of the FIBS Factor (F***, I’ve Been Shot!). Therefore, training a fast and reliable draw and first shot in the meaty bits is most important, in my opinion. It is THE critical skill to winning the gunfight. The best cover is fire superiority.

4. Follow-up shots are necessary. Seldom do gunfights END with that first shot, so keep at him until he decides he is done fighting. This is where multiple target acquisition is important, because it simulates a moving target to hit. (unless you have a fancy moving target that can move erratically, in which case you are high speed!)

5. People have a crazy tendency to use the gun one-handed, mostly because they have stuff in their support hand. Training people to drop what's in their hands and get two hands on the gun is a necessary skill for #3 and 4.

6. You simply WILL NOT stand still while someone wants to kill you. Unless you're counter-ambushing, when the gun comes out you will move. So training students to move with purpose while #3 and 4 are going on is also a critical skill. They're going to do it, so teach them to use it.

7. Chasing deadly threats is another bad habit that I see all the time. Teach your students to shoot and scoot. Move AWAY from the threat.

8. Concealment ain't cover, but it works identically in 99.9% of cases. People won't shoot what they can't see, so teach your students to get to concealment, and to shoot through it if their threat is behind it.

9. People love cover so much they give it a hug. Reliably. Like all the time. Teaching distance from cover/concealment is an important skill and one that is necessary.

10. Malfunctions happen. They just do. But unless you're carrying a crap gun, they're rare. In all my videos I have never seen someone clear a malfunction that needed a tap to the baseplate to get the gun back working again or whose mag fell out when the gun went click...rack and reassess is necessary though. In a couple of instances, a strip, rack, reload would have helped.

Just some random thoughts...I hope we have met your jimmy rustling needs for today.

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Re: Winning a real gunfight

Post by Dave M » Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:33 pm

I agree completely. I have subscribed to his channel, and it has been very enlightening.

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