Bubbas: Know your back-stop

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Cardboard_killer
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by Cardboard_killer » Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:15 pm

firemedic2000 wrote:But we can go back an forth all day on this and neither one of us will give on this subject.
Tell you what, you go ask your priest or preacher about it, and I bet he (or she) tells you there's a big difference.

Next you can tell me how US bomber pilots that accidentally bomb weddings have the same moral and legal responsibility as a suicide bomber that accidentally kills a passing radical imam. Hey, they're both accidents, right?

Or the drunk who lets an illegal bonfire get out of control and burns someone to death has the same moral and legal responsibility as a firefighter that accidentally drops someone he is trying to carry out of a burning building to their death.

Because all accidents are equal.
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by flcracker » Mon Jul 10, 2017 9:34 pm

Dang, dudes.

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and some rin up hill and down dale, knapping the chucky stanes to pieces wi' hammers, like sae mony road-makers run daft - they say it is to see how the warld was made!

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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by P5 guy » Tue Jul 11, 2017 5:12 am

In the recent past a couple of K9 officers died in patrol cars. What would the penalty be if I saw a K9 suffering in a hot car and broke the window to save the poor dog?
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by 870Mike » Tue Jul 11, 2017 6:34 am

P5 guy wrote:In the recent past a couple of K9 officers died in patrol cars. What would the penalty be if I saw a K9 suffering in a hot car and broke the window to save the poor dog?
:-k
No penalty in FL.

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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by Cloaked Dagger » Tue Jul 11, 2017 3:23 pm

Cardboard_killer wrote:
firemedic2000 wrote:But we can go back an forth all day on this and neither one of us will give on this subject.
Tell you what, you go ask your priest or preacher about it, and I bet he (or she) tells you there's a big difference.

Next you can tell me how US bomber pilots that accidentally bomb weddings have the same moral and legal responsibility as a suicide bomber that accidentally kills a passing radical imam. Hey, they're both accidents, right?

Or the drunk who lets an illegal bonfire get out of control and burns someone to death has the same moral and legal responsibility as a firefighter that accidentally drops someone he is trying to carry out of a burning building to their death.

Because all accidents are equal.
I agree that the police shooting of an innocent during a firefight with a suspect is not an equal crime as someone recklessly target shooting who accidentally shoots an innocent. I disagree that it isn't a crime at all though. The police are still responsible for where their bullets go even in a firefight. While I understand that the accident happened while under high stress that doesn't change the fact that an innocent person died because the person firing the round wasn't sure of what was beyond their target. I think given the difference of circumstances that the police officer should face a lower punishment, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't face any punishment. At the very least they shouldn't ever be working a position where they might end up in another firefight and thus killing another bystander. I wouldn't say some jail time would be unreasonable either, they are supposed to be trained to keep calm even under stress and were careless in the use of their weapon that lead to the death of an innocent.
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by P5 guy » Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:07 am

Mike, that law is for peasant on peasant not peasant on authority/government agent.
Pretty good bet the dog would be turned loose on me a hickory shampoo and gravel eating would occur and then I'd be made to buy a new window.
So, I'm not going to try that.
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by 870Mike » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:20 am

Well...mystery solved. No "Bubba's" involved...just Jose and HoseB (and they walked!):

Detectives Solve Mystery of South Florida Fisherman's Death; No Charges Will Be Filed

Sun Sentinel - Tuesday, Oct. 17, 2017

The mystery of the fisherman who died in a hail of bullets on the edge of the Everglades has been solved, with detectives declining to file charges for a bizarre reason that could have come from a TV crime drama.

Lawrence Ramdass, 46, of Plantation, was fishing from a boat in the Holey Land Wildlife Management Area in Palm Beach County last July when several shots rang out. One bullet struck him in the chest.

The shots came from a .45-caliber gun being fired for target practice by two men, Ricardo Galvan and Christian Salcedo, about a third of a mile away, according to the Palm Beach County Sheriff’s Office.

But because the two men had been taking turns firing the gun and could not see Ramdass, who was behind a vegetation-covered berm, detectives don’t know which one of them fired the fatal shot.

“Investigators found no criminal intent and this appears to be a tragic accident,” said Teri Barbera, spokeswoman for the sheriff’s office. “PBSO detectives met with members of the Palm Beach County State Attorney’s Office and all agreed that there is no probable cause for an arrest at this time.”

The victim’s sister, Sandy Stallone, said she is shocked and disappointed that no charges were filed for what was at least an act of extreme recklessness.

“It wasn’t hunting season, and they shouldn’t be firing a weapon in the first place,” she said. “There are signs out there saying it’s illegal to shoot. Anyone that fires a weapon, you’re responsible for your actions, accident or no accident. I’m disappointed with our system. What example does this set for us?”

Neither Galvan nor Salcedo could be reached for comment.

The two men were firing in an area known to wildlife officers as the top illegal target-shooting range in the area. A Sun Sentinel review of state law enforcement records found that 125 people have been caught illegally firing guns in that area, with all but three let off with warnings.

A state wildlife officer had seen and questioned two men in that area around the time of the shooting but had rushed off to respond to try to help Ramdass. He worked with a sketch artist from the Sheriff’s Office. Detectives also found what was described as “evidence that appeared to be fresh” and were able to lift fingerprints from it.

They tracked down Galvan. He told detectives that he had been target shooting with his friend, Salcedo, an activity they had done there several times.

“Galvan voluntarily surrendered his .45 caliber gun for testing,” the Sheriff’s Office said. “Both males were cooperative and advised that they both shot multiple guns that day, handing them back and forth. They both shot Galvan’s .45 caliber gun throughout the afternoon.”

Testing confirmed that the fatal bullet came from that gun.

“The victim’s position was concealed from the target range by the target berm and a large amount of brush and tall grass,” Barbera said. “Galvan and Salcedo expected that no one would, or even could be behind the berm that they were shooting at. Although Galvan and Salcedo were cooperative, it cannot be determined who fired the fatal shot that struck and killed Lawrence.”


http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/florid ... story.html
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by g.willikers » Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:39 am

We were once members of a private shooting club that bordered a winding river.
It nearly was permanently closed when something similar happened.
Bullets were leaving the club shooting ranges and landing in the river quite a distance away.
Folks who were fishing from a boat reported the incident.
Fortunately nobody was hit that day.
Good backstops don't always offset irresponsible actions.

As for the mistakes of the police during shoot outs with criminals, not very many rank and file get anywhere nearly the training they should.
Budgets and lack of initiative seem to prevail.
For example, there was an early morning confrontation between two squad cars of local cops against one escaping criminal just two blocks from us.
Twenty five rounds were fired, none from the criminal with one hit on the guy.
And this was in gas station with homes all around in every direction.
A local firearms trainer offered a special deal for advanced training to anyone on the local force.
Very few took him up on it.
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Re: Bubbas: Know your back-stop

Post by patw » Wed Oct 18, 2017 4:30 pm

Very sad to hear this. I can't imagine going out for a day of fishing with the family and being shot by random.

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