Corping In FL. Q's.

Machine guns, SBRs, SBSs, suppressors, destructive devices, AOW (any other weapon)
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Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by Guest » Mon May 17, 2004 6:33 pm

Saw this posted on subguns, and saved it.

The question was something like "What do I have to do when I corp in Florida to get a C3 goodie"

The answer was this
Under Florida state law, you must:
1.) File an Annual Report/Uniform Business Report and pay the $150 annual fee (make sure you file before each May 1, when the $400 late-filing fee brings it to $550). For an extra $8.75 they will send you a Certificate of Status, which shows the corp is active and paid up; I always include a copy with our Form 4 applications. This report/fee/etc. can be handled online at florida.gov.
2.) File a Florida Tangible Property Tax Form 1019/DR405 with your county property appraiser, listing all the corporation's assets, and pay the appropriate tax on them when the county sends you the tax bill.
3.) File a Florida Intangible Property Tax return. The first $250,000 of assets are exempt, so it's another zeroed-out form with no tax due in most cases. As in (4.) it can be done online and you may or may not need to file the paperwork; check the web site.
4.) File a Corporate Income Tax (Form F-1120), listing the income as reported on your federal tax return. Again, if the corporation reports zero income, no state income tax is due. In some cases, you may not have to even file this if the corp has zero income, but you should check each year as the law keeps changing. Again, this can be done online at florida.gov.
The corporation also should have an annual meeting attended by any/all corporate officers. It can last as little as 15 seconds, but should be held, and a report of the meeting typed up and kept in the corporate records, since an annual meeting is a state requirement. (Of course, if the corporation has only one stockholder who is also the sole corporate officer, he can "meet with himself" and type the memo.)
Once the corporation starts making money and/or selling any of its assets, things get more complicated. So it is worth documenting all corporate expenses and purchases to offset any future tax liability.
Do all you guys have to do all this s';t?
If so, there may be a WTS ad for a Powder Springs MAC coming up real soon...

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tony k
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Post by tony k » Mon May 17, 2004 6:44 pm

Well, since that's my post you quoted .... yes, I do all that. Technically, that is what is required by law.

If you don't do 1.), the state revokes your corp charter and any NFA assets instantly become unregistered contraband. Subject to seizure and destruction by BATF, etc., etc.

I know some folks skip 2.) and 3.). You may get caught, and you may not.

3.) and 4.) just involve going to the florida.gov web site and taking a few min to fill out a form (no tax due if corp has no income), so why not do it?

I do it all because I can't afford to risk losing the $20k in NFA toys owned by my corp. And because some day I may just decide to sell the entire corp along with its assets, and a buyer WILL want to see records that you crossed every "t" and dotted every "i".

YMMV. How lucky do ya feel, McUZI? :smile

Or should I say, how much for the Powder Springs?

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Post by Guest » Mon May 17, 2004 7:00 pm

No, that was a good reply.
Owning a corp NFA weapon and neglecting to follow a rule and "hope you don't get caught" is stupid.

If I sell the MAC, it will be for going rate, which seems to be $100 more every time I look. :eek Last one I saw *sell* went for 25, there is one up right now for 26-something, and some turkey as one up for 35 (I read subguns and sturmgewehr 4 times a day :eek )

(Don't worry SKS. If it gets sold, you'll be taken care of). ](*,)

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by mjmensale » Mon May 17, 2004 8:00 pm

Under Florida state law, you must:

1.) File an Annual Report/Uniform Business Report and pay the $150 annual fee.

Absolutely, or you lose the corporate status and goodies become illegal!

2.) File a Florida Tangible Property Tax Form 1019/DR405 with your county property appraiser.

These are "hard" assets like capital equipment and inventories. This would be your goodies.

3.) File a Florida Intangible Property Tax return.

"Intangibles" are things like accounts receivables, notes receivables, intellectual properties, etc. As opposed to "hard" assets like inventories and capital assets. Most small corporations don't have any.

4.) File a Corporate Income Tax (Form F-1120).

Unless your corp. has items of income or expenses, you don't have to file a federal 1120. Also, if you elect to become an S-Corp (federal), you don't normally need to file a Florida corporate return. But rules change.

The corporation also should have an annual meeting attended by any/all corporate officers...

Not a big deal. Once a year you meet with yourself, discuss corporate business, type up the minutes and stick'em in your corporate book. Typing the minutes can take longer than having the meeting!

Once the corporation starts making money and/or selling any of its assets, things get more complicated. So it is worth documenting all corporate expenses and purchases to offset any future tax liability.

Yup!

Moe
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Post by philasteen » Mon Nov 15, 2004 2:43 pm

Just form a Florida LLC. That only requires 1 filing per year and a $50 fee. No separate federal or state tax returns or other filings.

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Post by liquid » Wed Jan 12, 2005 9:52 pm

Ok, so maybe I'm asking a stupid question here but if you incorporate do you need to attain an FFL for class 2 weapons? What are the advantages or incorporating?

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Post by tony k » Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:26 pm

liquid wrote:Ok, so maybe I'm asking a stupid question here but if you incorporate do you need to attain an FFL for class 2 weapons? What are the advantages or incorporating?
Civilian individual ownership of National Firearms Act "Title 2" items --machine guns, sound suppressors, short-barrelled rifles, short-barrelled shotguns, AOWs (Any Other Weapon class devices), and destructive devices, which are explosives and cannon above .50 caliber -- require you to get the signature of the Chief Law Enforcement Officer (CLEO) of the jurisdiction in which you reside to sign your application for each item. Many CLEOs refuse to sign (which is a whole 'nother topic), and without that signature, you can't take possession of any of the above items.

Corporations are not required to get CLEO signatures. Instead, the corporate officer just fills out the paperwork, sends in a $200 transfer tax check along with a Certificate of Citizenship to BATF in D.C., and when the approved form comes back a few months later, he may take possession.

Neither individuals nor corporations are required to have an FFL to purchase NFA items.

In addition, by law only one individual may own each NFA item, and it must be in locked storage whenever it is not in his possession -- even his wife cannot have access to it. With corporate ownership, any member of the board of directors, or any paid employee, may be authorized to have access to and possession of the NFA items.

HTH. :smile

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Post by mjmensale » Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:42 pm

tony k wrote:In addition, by law only one individual may own each NFA item, and it must be in locked storage whenever it is not in his possession -- even his wife cannot have access to it. With corporate ownership, any member of the board of directors, or any paid employee, may be authorized to have access to and possession of the NFA items.
What I did was to "hold a Board meeting" and passed a resolution specifically naming those individuals who could access and possess the NFA items. I keep a copy of these Minutes with the copy of the stamp.

Moe
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. Claire Wolfe

Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you. John Steinbeck

If you try to take our firearms, we will kill you. Mike Vanderboegh

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Post by Casual » Wed May 18, 2005 5:12 pm

......... :eek holy shi'ite batman!!!! I just realised.... I'm the VP of our family corp.!!!!! LOL... Calm..... Calm.... Calm..... *runs for his check book*!!!!
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NFA ownership by anybody or Corp.

Post by Roach » Wed Nov 22, 2006 9:21 pm

Well tony K you left out a few things Bud. The only weapons that can be owned by individual or corp. without an FFL/Sot3 license is TRANSFERABLE WEAPONS OR DEVICES.Anything On the NFA Act manufactured past may of 1986 other than Silencers or Sbr's or Sbs's is restricted to Sot 3 dealers that have a request letter of demostration for said post sample weapons.Any Full auto weapon or device that was imported between 1968 and May 1986 is restricted to SOT3 dealers known as Premay dealer samples. Whats nice about the premay dealer samples other than the fact that you have to Have an Sot3 license to purchase a premay dealer sample is with that license is when you go to surrender your FFL/Sot 3 license you can 4473 the premay dealer samples to yourself and keep them until you deside to sell them, But can only sell them to an Active Ffl/Sot 3 dealer.I know, I have 14 Nfa weapons that are on form 4's that are corporate transfers. But once you terminate the corp. you better have the weapons or devices transferred to yourself or a Sot 3 dealer.
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Post by glockpacker » Wed Nov 22, 2006 9:43 pm

Whoops! Took you 2 1/2 years to spot that one, there, Roach!
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Post by tony k » Thu Nov 23, 2006 12:36 am

Welcome to FSN, Roach.

This thread concerns use of a corporation to own NFA items. It is not intended to be a comprehensive list of every aspect of NFA ownership. I also neglected to mention that the sky is blue, and that hurricanes sometimes hit Florida. Mea culpa, but it's all off-topic.

BTW, the import ban included in GCA 1968 covered all NFA items, not just full-auto firearms. That means that imported suppressors, SBRs, SBS's, AOWs and DDs also are restricted to possession as dealer samples, although since they were not listed in FOPA '86 they are not subject to the restrictions placed on post-'86 machine guns.

However, domestically manufactured AOWs and DDs are still fully transferable to non-licensees (in the state of Florida at least).

It's always good to hear from a fellow stamp collector. Just please, don't call me "Bud." :smile

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by CDi » Thu May 29, 2008 1:37 pm

trust is so much easier..unless you already have a Corp business, don't go thru that trouble
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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by iiibdsiil » Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:57 pm

I finally got my Serbu Super Shorty, and now I have some questions hopefully y'all can answer.

The paperwork for the gun has the company name on it (obviously). So, when I go to the range/get pulled over/ATF comes to my door, how do they know that the company is me? Because of box 15 on the form 4 correct?

How do I go about making it so that someone else is able to have the thing in their possession? For instance, my mom or dad.

What do I need to do about "possession." My company is registered at my condo. I'm going to have a friend over (very well trusted friend, no thought whatsoever about needing to typically put/lock my guns up). Does this thing need to be locked up if I walk to the bathroom to take a pee? Or go to the kitchen to get a drink?

And about when it needs to be locked up, does it need to be in a safe? Just a regular cable lock? Cable lock to a semi-permanent structure? I have a safe I can squeeze it into, but I'd rather not if I didn't have too. It's just a regular safe for paperwork and I have to take stuff out to put it in there.

Also, where can I find this information online? Like an official source or something. I've spent WAY too much time Googling, searching the ATF site, etc and I can't find much info.

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by HotShot308 » Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:26 pm

I can answer this one...
How do I go about making it so that someone else is able to have the thing in their possession? For instance, my mom or dad.
Make them an officer of the Corp.
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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by iiibdsiil » Tue Aug 19, 2008 1:46 am

Then if they get pulled over, how do they go about showing they are an officer?

I tell ya what, they couldn't make this any more complicated. #-o

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by tony k » Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:24 am

iiibdsiil wrote:Then if they get pulled over, how do they go about showing they are an officer?

I tell ya what, they couldn't make this any more complicated. #-o
See Moe's response above: The corporation's board of directors must pass a resolution indicating which corporate officers may possess and use the corp's NFA assets. You then make signed copies of that resolution, emboss each with the corporate seal, and give each authorized officer a copy to carry along with the copy of the Form 1 or Form 4 for the item.

If any LE questions the validity of the resolution, they can go to the State of Florida web site and look up the corporate officers of your corporation -- it is public record and is online there. Just make sure that you notify the state of exactly who the officers of your corp are.

And FYI, if ya want simple, stay away from NFA. The feds intentionally make it as complicated as possible, hoping you will give up and go away without NFA. ](*,)

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by iiibdsiil » Tue Aug 19, 2008 10:11 am

Thanks, I missed that part somehow.

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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by NonConformist » Tue Aug 19, 2008 10:55 am

I think ill just do a trust. Thats expensive yearly fees etc;
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Re: Corping In FL. Q's.

Post by liquidm1980 » Thu Dec 09, 2010 5:40 pm

What are the advantages of a corp over a trust?

Thanks

Liquid

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